January 26, 2007

How Much Money Is A Few Months Of Torture Worth?

Maher Arar, settled for $10 million because he was on the terrorist watch list in the US and deported to his NATIVE Syria (where he was ALLEGEDLY tortured), instead of being allowed to return to Montreal a few year ago.

Ok that is an oversimplification. If you want the details click here.

Besides the obvious questions as to WHY he was on the terror list?, and WHY Syria would torture a TERRORIST?, or even, WHY would Syria torture a non terrorist? And why hasn't the USA removed Arar from their terror list yet? After reading a post by Deepsouth, one comment stands out: Would the Canadian government please send me
to Syria so that I can be abused for a healthy
10 Million bucks.

He originally sued for $400 MILLION, so maybe the Canadian government figured the $12.8 million it is paying out to be a bargoon. Personally, the amount being paid out is beyond obscene.

This leads me to my hypothetical question:

If you were "falsely" accused of a crime and deported to another country (it doesn't even have to be the country you were born in), and you were tortured (not even allegedly tortured), how much money would you accept from your government for a few months of jail and torture? Remember: You will not be raped or murdered and you will return to the country you now call home in around one year.

I'm not a fan of Sadism/Masochism. I'm not that kinky. Doesn't do anything for me sexually or even emotionally. But I would be willing to take a vacation for $200,000. How about you?

The Canadian taxpayer is paying for this fiasco. To be honest, this makes me not want to pay taxes.


  1. You are right where you belong in your pussified pantywaste govt country where you don't pay much tax anyway since we know you collect social welfare and back disability payments.

  2. I have to disagree with you on this one.

    I am a strong supporter of Canadian security. There are people with extreme hatred for our evil decandance (otherwise known as liberty) and they are a threat.

    But when we screw up, we need to make ammends. And just like someone who wins millions for false imprisonment, even if at the time the cops had a strong case, he deserved compensation.

    This was a message. Canada WILL fight for liberty but we also clean up our own mess.

    I think it was the right thing to do.

    Also, sorry I have been away so long. Still enjoying your blog.

  3. My point isn't whether he deserved compensation, Jordan, but the size of the compensation.

    David Milgaard and family received 10 million for 19 years of wrongful imprisonment.

    This was only a year. And Canada didn't even do the deporting.

  4. BEAJ:

    You are wrong in so many ways here.

    You are disingenuous when you write, "deported to his NATIVE Syria." It's true he was born and raised in Syria, but he was a Canadian citizen. In other words, the U.S. deported a Canadian citizen to Syria against his and Canada's wishes.

    (where he was ALLEGEDLY tortured)

    Why is ALLEGEDLY in caps? Do you have reason to disbelieve the allegation?

    Besides the obvious questions as to WHY he was on the terror list?

    See wikipedia. "They claimed that Arar was an associate of Abdullah Almalki, a Syrian-born Ottawa man whom they suspected of having links to the al-Qaeda terror organization, and they therefore suspected Arar of being an al-Qaeda member himself."

    In other words, he was an associate of someone they thought might have links to al-Qaeda. Investigate him, sure, but deportation? To Syria?

    how much money would you accept from your government for a few months of jail and torture?

    I would not do it for a million bucks (or ten million.) And it's not like they asked him first.

  5. JA, he is and still remains a duo citizen. He never dropped his Syrian citizenship to my knowledge.

    Canada wasn't fighting for him too strong, this is why they awarded the dough.

    I have questions about why Syria would punish him if he was a saint, that is why I capped Allegedly.

    OK, so you wouldn't do it for 10 million bucks. I would.

    Again, the way the facts came out, compensation should have been awarded, but not that much.

    And again, Arar is still on the terror list in the USA.

  6. Also there is a large report that basically just takes Arars word for it that he was tortured. 10 million bucks for his word?

  7. Hey I hear that they made Arar watch Big Mommas house 2. That's worth 10 mil easy.

  8. It seems that compensation for torture is much better renumeration than compensation for permanent disability. A finger is worth about $2000, a whole hand $20000, whole leg $50000 (being optimistic), complete loss of mental faculties $2million. Death on the job $100000 if the victim is young. I would definitely go for the torture option.

  9. John Kerry and Ben Nelson just met with Assad -- you mean Syria is an evil government? Surely you guys jest. I thought the Syrian government was rational and could be trusted to behave well.

    The word torture these days is confused with the word abuse. So, when you keep someone awake for 48 hours, or chain them to the floor in a fetal position until they crap themselves, it is now called torture, even though there is no physical damage.

    I publically debated a socialist on Iraq last April, and the topic of torture came up. He excused Saddam's crimes-- the amputations, the shredders, the acid baths, while condemning what the United States does at Gitmo. The reason-- America inflicts spiritual damage on people, while thugs like Saddam only hurt the body.

    I was amazed. This pushed me closer to the view that the problem with liberalism is liberalism--- they are wrong because they are liberals. They think market, family, and country makes people inauthentic, while oppressed 3rd-world people rebelliously create their own values. Liberals at the core feel the West is in bondage to sin and cannot free itself, and we can only achieve redemption by working towards its destruction, ahem, creating a better future, since the market, the family, and liberal democracy create so much spiritual damage.

    You can see this above. Jewish Atheist above assumes a priori that we cannot disbelieve the allegation, and is apparently confortable with handing out 10 million to atone for our guilt for being intolerant, xenophobic, hegemonic, racist westerners. Evidence? Logic? Who needs it?

  10. Kill them all and let god sort it out.

  11. The major disappointment for me is that it's the Canadian government that's providing the compensation. For a moment I thought the US government had actually admitted to doing something wrong. Silly of me.

    The hypothetical money question doesn't much interest me. It's not as if either Arar or the US government could predict what he was getting into. He might have been lucky and not have been tortured; or he might have been really unlucky and not come out alive. This isn't a game show.

  12. Hi Bacon,
    Thanks for the post, you kind of caught a bit of a chink in my Biblical understanding. I responded in kind.
    I hope this isn't too off topic.
    Take care.

  13. HG, never saw it, but it sounds like torture.

    Lex, great analogy. How many people get tortured for free? (and don't want to get tortured) This award was way too high. 32k a day. Who does he think he is? Donald Trump.

    Jason, great points. Yes there is a lack of evidence here, and far left liberals tend to believe that "victims" don't have a reason to lie.
    I'm a social liberal as I've stated here before, but I am also a realist/skeptic who needs as many facts as possible, before I declare a side.

    Rickey, who are you talking bout now? The voices in your head?

    Gary, a question is why shouldn't the Syrian government pay. And I do think the size of the award is preposterous.

    Hg, it is always best to reply to the last post unless you are in the middle of a debate. The last post is the one I'll most likely look at, so I have no problem with what you did here.
    Normally, you are supposed to start off with OT Bacon,.....the OT doesn't stand for Old Testament but Off Topic.
    I'll check your reply.

  14. Hi Bacon,
    Man, I was just looking over your older blog posts and holy crap! I appluade you for your patience (ricky) you're an atheist, is he a theist? All I could tell is he loves to type the word "goy". I've grown to like you looking through your posts. I'm a bit weird in the sense that I grew up in the Stone Cambell movement, a restoration movement that led to the Crossroads Ministry in Florida, to the Boston Movement, which became the International Churches of Christ. Which kind of died after Kip Mckeans kids didn't want to be dicsiples, well it was Olivia for sure, Eric is still on the fence. They're friends.
    And odly, the church really had little to say on the subject of Evolution, but my parents had very strong feelings.
    If you get a minute look up Kip Mckean, International Church of Christ, San Diego, Sorry I'm just rambling on, I must be stoned. Anyway I'm not going to be a pest.
    Take care.

  15. HG, I hope you've figured out that if you were adopted at an early age by Muslims, or Jews, or Catholics, you wouldn't be a Baptist today in all likelihood. This is why you should never get carried away that you have the right answers. In fact, none of the above do, but that is a different story.

    Rickey doesn't discuss his beliefs. He is a rabid Jew hater and he also seems to hate women.
    I have speculated about his background previously. I think he is Muslim and he once admitted to have originated from the Ukraine.

    It is hard to say how much of his nonsense is an act, or if he just has the immaturity of a Grade 2 student or if he is insane in a Cybill type of way.

  16. You need to see if major turd mikey will do some post composition for you. Your plagarised tripe is quite boring.

  17. HG is gay. The blog host needs a real job and a life. He keeps reposting outhouse contents.

  18. I have to agree with Jason, here. (btw, Jason, long time no see!)

    But I have more to say.

    Deporting this man to Syria seems fundamentally stupid. In this global world, deportation is simply not enough protection. If the guy is a terrorist, he should be locked up, not deported. If he's not a terrorist, he should be off the terror watch list, and some level of compensation is fair.

    Something's wrong when this scenario is allowed to occur.

  19. two lips on the organ:

    The issue is fundamentally stupid and demonstrates how screwed up and pussified the Canadian govt and mind is. The people and the govt deserve each other.

  20. Hi, while I pretty much agree with the rest of the comments on your blog this is one I don't agree with.

    I would be surprised if you would be "willing" to endure 24 hours of torture for any sum of money, let alone months.

    The compensation is not a "reward" and it is not "payment" for something this person volunteered for. It is disingenuous to compare it to a wrongful arrest in a westernised criminal system, unless Canadian jails can be compared to the treatment in a Syrian prison (even putting the torture aside). In your example you specify that "you wont be raped or killed" however there is no way the prisoner knows that at the time.

    I have worked with people who have been subjected to cruel and inhumane treatments for various lengths of time and can honestly say I would not willingly subject myself for any sum of money. If it were forced upon me I would demand a lot more than $10m as compensation.

    If the compensation is trivial, there is no deterrent to the respective governments and nothing to encourage them to tighten up their procedures.

  21. Tas, no two people agree on everything.

    I think 1 million would have been sufficient in this case.

    Maybe less. I read the evidence, and the accusations of torture, though they may have happened, were completely based on his Arar's word and the fact that Syria tortures prisoners. Not enough evidence for a skeptic like myself.

    Also, why didn't Syria and the US pay the compensation? Why Canada?

    And Arar still retains a Syrian citizenship as I understand it. I don't have a clue why he would be tortured if he did have terrorist ties, and I really don't understand it, if he didn't.