April 21, 2007

Wasn't God Allowed In Schools When Hitler Was A Kid?

Warning: This video will insult your intelligence:

Seung-Hui Cho, the Virginia madman, mentions Jesus Christ how many times in the video he sent to MSNBC?
He seemed to know all about Jesus. Maybe that is the problem.

"Thanks to you, I die like Jesus Christ, to inspire generations of the weak and the defenceless people."

"Do you know what it feels like to be humiliated and be impaled on a cross and left to bleed to death for your amusement?"

From Wikipedia. 1959 Texas:

Paul Orgeron and Dusty Paul

Paul Orgeron was a tile-setter from South Houston, Texas who had been attempting to enroll his son Dusty into elementary school. Orgeron and his son had been living in a boarding house under the pseudonym of Bob Silver, for reasons unknown, before the massacre. They were said to have been quiet and never made any trouble.

Eventually Orgeron attempted to enroll his son at Edgar Allan Poe Elementary School but was denied on the grounds that he lacked a birth certificate for his son. He left the school claiming he would return the next day with the necessary documentation.

The attack

On September 15, around 10:00 a.m., Orgeron and his son approached a teacher who was about to enter one of the classrooms. At the time he was carrying a brown suitcase with unknown contents. The teacher was given two pieces of paper by Orgeron and asked to read them. According to the teacher the papers were completely illegible, and she was unable to understand them. While she tried to read the notes Orgeron mumbled under his breath about "having power in a suitcase," and the will of God.

He asked that all the children gather into a circle around him. The teacher became suspicious after seeing a mysterious button on the bottom of the suitcase. Seeing her distress other teachers joined her and Orgeron was asked to leave school grounds. When he refused the teachers began to evacuate the children away from Orgeron, and shortly thereafter Orgeron detonated the briefcase which was estimated to contain six sticks of dynamite. The explosion claimed six lives, including both Orgeron and his son. Two other students, a custodian and a teacher also perished.
School shootings are tragedies, but they are not proof that God needs to be taught in classrooms. In fact, I would say the opposite is true. Considering the relatively low amount of these tragic incidents that have occurred, and when they do, they are usually done by the God knowing.
Maybe God just wants it to be harder for student who believe in him to get a gun.


  1. This reminds me of that creepy scumbag Tom Delay stating on the House floor that teaching evolution in schools caused the Columbine massacre. I've always believed Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold caused it.

    If teaching evolution was a sufficient condition for school violence, one wonders why we don't see more of it in other countries, like France, where it isn't watered down to avoid the delicate feelings of fundie parents.

  2. God isn't allowed in schools? Not very [powerful is he...

    "Sorry god, you are banned from school."

    God's reply : "Ok, I am omnicient, omnipotent and omnipresent, but you are right - schools have a supernatural force field which keeps me from entering. It is like a form of krypton like they use on superman."

    What this should indicate to theists is that if a god exists, and if it IS allpowerful, allknowing and present EVERYWHERE,that it is the LAST thing in the universe that needs their help.

  3. ROFLMAO! Beaj...that had to be satire, right? Right?
    I guess if they're serious than we should go back to torturing and burning people for not believing in God, insisting raped young girls have the babies of those who impregnated them, persecuting all those whose God is not the Christian God, allowing good Christian men to beat the hell out of their wives if the little lady deserves it, having an education system that teaches only biblical "history" and "science" as truth, and, hey, for good measure, let's throw in a bloody Crusade or two...(actually, that last one doesn't sound like such a bad idea given the general attitude of those in the muslim arab world these days).
    It's pretty bad when the Christians sound as moronic as the islamists...

  4. BEAJ:

    I'm in favour of simply ignoring this kind of crap: there is no evidence that allowing G-d in the classroom or not has any effect whatsoever on whatever. In the US this whole thing is completely politicised with both secularists and good old religious folk feeling under siege.

    In several European countries, pupils simply have the choice between one hour a week of religious education (RE) or an alternative class, usually called Ethics. That's a fair system where parents and pupils have a choice without the schools being turned into faith schools. In principle I don't see a problem with morning prayer either, as long as it would be completely optional, non-mandatory and not related to the curriculum. I have no problems with chapels and chaplains in hospitals either, as long as the latter take a hint when I give them one.

    In Britain, pupils do get RE but the class doesn't teach religion, it teaches about religions. I have no problem with my daughter (and she's become quite the little atheist) attending that class at all. Religion exists; I don't see why it can't be discussed in a classroom.

    In the same way, I see no problem with Creationism being taught in RE but not in a science class.

  5. Southie, they didn't mention anything about the Christian God. They could easily have been talking about the Wiccan God.

    Gert, the problem with what what you don't have a problem with, like prayer for example is who leads it, and which prayer is said. If the Lord's Prayer is said, of course, the Muslims will cry out, and want their prayers done in classroom as well.

    Does the RE classes include all religions, or does it just focus on the Christian religion?

    There are far too many religions out there to consider prayer in school. And should hospitals also have Mosques as well, and a hospital Imam?

  6. America was founded on Christian principles, asswipe.

  7. "Should hospitals also have Mosques as well, and a hospital Imam?"

    Why not? I think they should, in areas with a significant Muslim population.

    Oh, and they were citing Christian rules, so I think it's fairly certain that they were talking about the Christian god. Possibly the Jewish one, but they would have complained about things like alcohol if it was the Muslim one.

  8. BEAJ:

    It focusses on all major religions, but mainly concerns itself with the phenomenon of religion.

    It can be abused: I found out that a guest speaker was simply teaching the Gospel in one session. I complained to the head teacher: I've been assured it won't happen again.

    Regards Muslim and other religion's rights in schools and hospitals, you're right, but as long as equality can be maintained in theory that shouldn't cause problems.

    The easiest is of course to bannish the whole concept to the personal sphere but that causes some problems as well, see e.g. in France where all religious activity and symbols are banned from all state-related places, including Government buildings, schools, public hospitals etc etc.

    Drawback is that it can be exploited by those intolerant of religion...

  9. RE: "America was founded on Christian principles, asswipe."

    "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries." - So here we have a clear admission by the United States in 1797 that the government did not found itself upon Christianity.

  10. proof god doesn't exist

  11. I've said it before and I'll say it again - a belief in god should disqualify a person from the right to vote. Policy should not be decided by those without reason. If people aren't responsible enough to use reason then they negate the only reason to entrust them with responsibility.

  12. //Seung-Hui Cho, the Vermont [sic]madman, mention Jesus Christ how many times in the video he sent to MSNBC?
    He seemed to know all about Jesus. Maybe that is the problem.//

    What is with Vermont, you stooge?

  13. Thanks Rickey. I correct the error, and added a quote.

  14. The Educational Establishment
    One reason we have lost so many of our religious freedoms is that the liberal educational establishment has worked hard to eliminate our knowledge of the Judeo-Christian heritage of America. The facts nonetheless reveal the true convictions of our founders. Without question, they believed that although no one Christian denomination should dominate the nation, the principles of the Bible and Christianity should underlie our government and American education as well.

    "It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists but by Christians, not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ." - Patrick Henry

    "Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of a Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers." - U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice, John Jay

    The liberties we talk about defending today were established by men who took their conceptions of man from the great central religious tradition of Western civilization [Christianity], and the liberties we inherit can almost certainly not survive the abandonment of that tradition. The decay of decency in the modern age, the rebellion against law and good faith, the treatment of human beings as things, as mere instruments of power and ambition, is without a doubt the consequence of the decay of the belief in man as someone more than an animal animated by highly conditioned reflexes and chemical reactions. For unless man is something more than that, he has no rights that anyone is bound to respect, and there are no limitations upon his conduct which he is bound to obey. This is the forgotten foundation of democracy.
    [James Reston, "Faith of Our Fathers, Living Still?" The New York Times, April 2, 1969]

    Our children's history books are being rewritten so they no longer hear the truth about the tremendous influence of religious faith on America's founding fathers, on the great documents they drafted to establish a true republic based, on the critical tripod of liberty, life, and family. The revisionist history being taught now is devoid of any reference to the Christian faith of our Founding Fathers as the old stories, the old way that American history was taught, was revised to reflect a more liberal, politically correct, homogenized and multicultural perspective.

    Words like duty and honor and country have fallen out of vogue, and the stories of the Christian faith of men like George Washington and Patrick Henry and Noah Webster and so many others, Daniel Webster, Andy Jackson, Chief Justice John Marshall - magnificent Christians - these stories are simply left out.

    While many may squabble over who among the founding fathers was a Christian, no knowledgeable historian of early American history can deny the fact that the concept of a Creator God who endowed His creation with "unalienable rights" was an essential underpinning of the American experiment. These rights were derived not from a government that was transitory, but from a Governor who was eternal. It was the role of government to defend these rights and not dilute or remove them.

    The revisionists extend their influence outside the classroom as well into nearly every segment of American life. Descriptions and tours of the nation's capitol fail to point out that the Ten Commandments are inscribed in the marble of the United States Supreme Court, that there is a beautiful stained glass window in the U.S. Capitol depicting President George Washington kneeling in prayer, and that at the top of the Washington Monument - the highest point in the nation's capital is embedded a plaque which boldly proclaims in Latin, "Praise Be Unto God."

  15. None of the Founding Fathers had any knowledge about evolution or an ancient earth.
    It was hard not to believe in a creator back then.

    And the Judeo-Christian principals are mostly about ethics and morality that has evolved in us anyway.

    But the founders did lean towards separation of church and state.

  16. Stick to Canadian and Persian history, slim.

  17. It's clear that the faithful are running scared. Did you see Richard Dawkins v. Bill O'Reilly (the Bloviator) on Fox last night?

    Frankly, I don't see where all this fear is coming from: they have every right to worship their Psychopath in the Skies anyway. "America under G-d" is definitely turning into "G-d under America", though... (heh heh..)

  18. Gert, I saw it. The usual crap about Atheist regimes, and the big lie that Hitler was an atheist.
    I will most likely feel compelled to post about the interview later today.